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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 11 post(s) |
Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
3
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Posted - 2011.11.10 23:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
Daedalus Arcova wrote:I posted my thoughts in response to the hybrid rebalance in a different thread, so please refer to that: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=290102#post290102Some other things: - The damage difference between the 2nd and 3rd tier railguns is too small. Give the 150, 250 and 425mm rails a bit more damage, to make them a worthy step up from the 120, 200 and 350mm calibres. A few things about ammo: - Null ammo needs +50% for both optimal and falloff. Barrage gives a 50% falloff bonus, and Scorch gives 50% extra to range. Blasters depend on both range and falloff, so Null ought to give a 50% bonus for both, to help truly address the range issues of blasters. - Significantly increase base damage for Antimatter, Void and Javelin. This would make blasters truly melt face at close range. Railguns would be more viable for mid-range engagements, where their counterparts are actually pulse lasers and autocannons with long-range ammo. - Simplify the ammo types. There's too much granularity of range at present. Instead, make hybrid ammo more like projectile ammo, so different ammo types have different balances of thermal and kinetic damage, such as 20/80, 50/50 and 80/20.
Listen to this guy, he knows what he's talking about. Make it happen! |
Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.11 03:17:00 -
[2] - Quote
Been thinking about this some more, and am reposting this from a separate topic:
The bottom line is that if Gallente ships are supposed to be faster than Caldari and Amarr ships (but not as fast as Minmatar) then their weapons should have better range than Minimatar ships. The idea that blasters must be super short range seems to be locked into your heads, and perhaps you should disabuse yourself of that notion and extend their range considerably - make them function in-between AC's and pulse lasers in terms of damage and range.
Don't mess with armour plates and agility/mass penalties when the problem lies with the weapons. The same goes for Gallente ships; they're basically fine, its the blasters themselves that are at issue. Increase their optimal a lot and their falloff a little, reduce tracking and damage a bit and see how the numbers add up. Blaster boats won't need to be as fast as Minmatar if they have better range, and I think that works better for Caldari ships too, if they want to use blasters for a change (blaster ferox is pretty decent) since they're usually slower than Gallente ships, but finally their hybrid range bonus will make up that difference.
Improving tech 2 like Null and Void is fine, but the tech 1 ammo and guns need to be useable as well; you can't decide to play Gallente ships and then have to wait until you've got tech 2 guns to use them properly. |
Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
3
|
Posted - 2011.11.11 05:25:00 -
[3] - Quote
Nemesor wrote:Jazz Styles wrote:
Don't mess with armour plates and agility/mass penalties when the problem lies with the weapons.
Armor plates and agility and mass penalties are new to the game compare to the stats that the weapons have and were never balanced with them in mind. HENCE it might being a good idea to do so.
Agility and mass were added to enhance the game, removing them would be a step backwards; devolution as it were. This topic is about updating hybrids, and that's what should be happening given the current statistics on armour. |
Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
4
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Posted - 2011.11.11 06:31:00 -
[4] - Quote
Voith wrote:Nemesor wrote:Nemesor wrote:[quote=Jazz Styles]
Don't mess with armour plates and agility/mass penalties when the problem lies with the weapons.
Armor plates and agility and mass penalties are new to the game compare to the stats that the weapons have and were never balanced with them in mind. HENCE it might being a good idea to do so. Why not just make some gallente ships shield tankers? If Armor + Blasters doesn't work I would think trying Shield + Blasters should be tried before you fundamentally alter game mechanics.
There's a certain symmetry at the moment with Amarr and Gallente being primarily armour, and Minmatar and Caldari being shield focused (obviously matari ships are much more flexible). I think CCP are reluctant to change this dynamic, but its probably worth talking about at least.
Here's the thing tho: If we're talking big fleet battles? In order to make blasters useful at point-blank range, the ships are going to have to be ridiculously fast, since all three other races can engage at range with ease, and even then it throws fleet formations completely out the window.
I just don't see why blasters have to be so short on range when it clearly isn't working. I suspect that nothing short of a substantial range increase on blasters is going to make Gallente attractive outside of empire space.
Here's an idea, just double the optimal range across the board for blasters, maybe add a 25% falloff increase, lower damage and tracking by 10%-15% and see how it goes. It's a test server; let's test it out. |
Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.11 14:00:00 -
[5] - Quote
It all comes down to getting the ship into the engagement zone of its weapons. In this instance, Gallente blaster boats either need to:
a) Be the fastest and most agile, because their weapons have the shortest range, or
b) Have the engagement range of blasters extended so they don't need that speed. |
Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
6
|
Posted - 2011.11.12 02:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
I like the idea that hybrids should have their own unique style to differentiate them from other turrets. If artillery is the highest alpha, perhaps rail guns could be the highest rate of fire of the long-range guns.
As for blasters, if they're going to stay as ultra short range weapons, then you need to make them powerful enough so that Gallente pilots will be eager to get in suicidally short range, and make other pilots regret it. Redonkulous firepower, I mean. |
Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
6
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Posted - 2011.11.12 03:08:00 -
[7] - Quote
Opertone wrote:Have you considered ammo costs? Railguns should be the most accurate weapon in game, which means very good damage vs small targets.
Lower ammo costs then. We're only talking 10% faster ROF, so 10% cheaper to make will cover it, and might even help make blasters more attractive.
Opertone wrote:I'd have more accuracy and stopping power in exchange for not being able to hit at close ranges. You are sniper fit, if something comes 30 km close, you are in trouble. Give rails small signature 125m for large, but very poor tracking. This will allow sniping and restrict close range combat.
They're already the longest range sniper weapons in the game, and apparently that's not good enough.
Opertone wrote:hit anything hard at long ranges, hit nothing at close ranges. Good trade.
You just described every long range turret in the game. Try thinking outside the box.
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Jazz Styles
Sileo In Pacis
6
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Posted - 2011.11.12 08:42:00 -
[8] - Quote
Pinky Denmark wrote:I think next move is on CCP - players pretty much gave them all we could with plenty argumentation for everything...
Yeah this has been a very thorough discussion, I can't think of anything else that needs coverage so I'm done here. Hoping for big improvements to hybrids real soon  |
Jazz Styles
SchlongBong
31
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Posted - 2011.11.22 01:55:00 -
[9] - Quote
This has probably been covered, but how about changing the armour rep bonus (obsolete) to a afterburner/mwd speed bonus, and then putting it on the gallente ships that are supposed to be blaster boats.
- Thorax & Deimos (remove the cap bonus and replace with speed)
- Hyperion
- Megathron? (Great blaster boat, but that tracking bonus is pretty sweet, and if the hyperion gets speed, it'll probably end up being better overall).
- Brutix and its variants.
- Myrmidon (I don't see this as a blaster boat, so change the rep bonus to be a hybrid damage bonus to make it a lighter version of the Dominix)
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Jazz Styles
SchlongBong
31
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Posted - 2011.11.22 07:38:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jaigar wrote:
With the Combat Booster change, these bonuses will be very nice, so I wouldn't exactly want to junk them.
If you're referring to the 7.5% rep bonus, it's generally accepted that local repping is an inferior option for pvp (granted it works on the myrmidon if you put 3 medium repairers on, but not many others can do that). This is why you don't see many hyperions, or armour tanked brutixes etc. The idea with changing that bonus to aid speed is to let blaster boats do what they're designed to do, better, and local repping isn't one of those things. |
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Jazz Styles
SchlongBong
31
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Posted - 2011.11.22 07:41:00 -
[11] - Quote
Rip Minner wrote:
Just no on the Myrmidon thing it's a drone boat thats why you dont see it as a blaster boat.
Yeah I see a lot of autocannon fitted myrms for the caplessness (same with prophecies and the other no-damage bonus ships)
Rip Minner wrote:
And yes it do's need it's bonus changed as well as the Dominix too. The Myrmidon needs to drop that rep bonus and the Dominix needs to drop that Hybird bonus and they both need it replaced with a 10% to armor hit points bonus to the ship it's not the drones if that's what anyone's thinking.
Ooo, I take it all back - change the rep bonus to a 10% armour hp bonus per level  |
Jazz Styles
SchlongBong
31
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Posted - 2011.11.22 11:06:00 -
[12] - Quote
Jaigar wrote:No, Synth are the only ones legal, and with level 4 skills, those will still give you around 6% boost for 400k isk to 1.5 mil. I already bought up a few hundred.
But those with more dough can throw 20-40 mil (20 in placid ATM) for +25% rep amount for up to 2 hours.. might see more local tank ships return.
And I guess it should be noted that local armor tank ships fly a little faster than their plated brethren, and during a fleet fight, if you can set it up to hold out in say 5 or less on each side fight for 1-2 minutes, it might be just enough...
Can't wait to test this out in proper pvp, I too had missed the change to boosters... myrm ftw  |
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